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Banter and Bitchin' - General Chat + Questions and Answers - RIP - victims of school massacare in Finland 7/11/07 :(
Poppy - 07.11.2007, 14:10
Post subject: RIP - victims of school massacare in Finland 7/11/07 :(
ATLEAST 4 HIT IN FINNISH SCHOOL SHOOTING
Official says 4 shot when teen opens fire in Finnish high school, 1 killed
By MATTI HUUHTANEN Associated Press Writer | AP
Nov 7, 2007
A teenager opened fire at a high school in southern Finland on Wednesday, killing one person and wounding three others, a municipal official said.
The incident was Finland's first known school shooting.
Heidi Hagman, assistant to the municipality director in Tuusula, some 30 miles north of the capital, Helsinki, told The Associated Press that an 18-year-old man opened fire inside the Jokela high school, shooting four people and killing one.
She said three others had been wounded and the shooter was still inside the school, which had been surrounded by police.
"Some of the pupils have managed to escape from the school but others are still inside," Hagman said.
She said more than 400 students between the ages of 12 and 18 were enrolled at the school.
..........................................................................................................
This is very disturbing ...
Stuff like this just doesn't happen here ... or haven't before.
I work in school myself and that's why this "touches" me a lot ...
Obviously you never know what's gonna happen tomorrow and SAFE Scandinavia has become like the rest of the world
News UPDATE -
5 to 7 students/teachers dead.
The killer is said to be also dead.
One victim in critical condition - tens of students are injured ...
Poppy - 07.11.2007, 16:37
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8 dead ... at the moment ...
5 boys
2 girls
principal of the school
shooter in critical condition with very serious head trauma (shot himself and most likely won't survive) ...
I still can't believe this ...
I am sorry for posting this at a poker forum, but it's been just very upsetting afternoon ...
Sisters - 08.11.2007, 00:04
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Hi,
It's such a tragedy...they are all in my thoughts and prayers...
Sarah
Poppy - 08.11.2007, 14:54
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Thank YOU, Sarah (((HUGS)))
Very tough day at work today ... The tragedy was all what everyone talked about ... PLUS a co-worker of mine lost his parents day before yesterday in a car crash Both died.
9 people died in the end in the school shooting ... The killer himself died in hospital 10PM Finnish time yesterday. 10 hours after he shot himself.
We had crisis meeting for all the students and staff today. It was so sad to see little children crying and holding candles ...
Today is a day of national mourning - I just walked home from work and all I could see was flags flying in half masts.
The media here doesn't have any other news apart the shooting.
It's so bizarre this kind of thing has even happened here ...
It's also weird how foreign media paints really negative image of my home country ... Like British The Times (Time's article in quotes) -->
"Finland is a land of wide open spaces, barely 120 people per square kilometre. Lakes often separate neighbouring farmsteads"
GEEZE - we do have LOADS of big cities over here!!!
And btw - Finland is a country of thousands of lakes and islands; 187,888 lakes (larger than 500 mΒ²) and 179,584 islands to be precise. So LOADS of water ... but those are not stopping us to travel around them as we have very good road, rail, flight etc networks.
"At this time of year it is sunk in almost permanent half-light and Finnish families count the days to their winter holidays when they can flee to the bright sunlight of south-east Asian resorts"
Yeah - if ONLY ...
"Clinical depression is high, the suicide rate too. But above all the Nordic winter isolates the young in the small towns: they arrive at school in the dark and leave it in the dark, travelling long distances to their homes. Friendship in the traditional sense is often a summer luxury"
OMG ... I have to LOL ... The shooter lived about 30 mins drive from finland's capital Helsinki - Meteropolitan Helsinki area ... Hardly a LONGGGGG distance to school and friends (???) made him committing what he did ...
"And so friendship becomes virtual. The social networking sites are switched on the moment the Finnish teenager returns home. YouTube substitutes for television, which is regarded as dreary and middle-aged"
Duh - I though it's the same ALL OVER THE WORLD???
"About 75 per cent of all Finns use the internet. And Finland, the cradle of Nokia, has some of the cheapest mobile phone rates in Europe"
Cheapest mobile phone rates in Europe??? Oh please ... mine cost β¬495!!! And it's even those best, real fancy ones ...
"Kids as young as 6 take mobiles to school; a childβs first text message is a matter of parental pride"
Kids start school in Finland when they are 7 years old!!! And I don't think 7 year olds type text messages as MOST of them can't read or write right away when starting school ...
"None of this is unusual for modern Europe, but in Finland the high-tech world has become a normal, rather than an exceptional, substitute for the world of human contact"
HUH???
"A youth isolated at school sinks even deeper into isolation when he has left the school gates: a recipe for trouble. Even more so in a country where guns are so readily available; Finland has the third-largest per capita ownership of handguns in the world"
Umm ... great thet the jounalist forgot to mention that shooting was the killers hobby and he had a licence to his gun, so it was legal ... AND guns aren't really that common!!! I don't know anyone who has a gun apart from couple uncles of mine who hunt deers and mooses every autumn.
It's been funny to read some replies this article got at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/article2828084.ece
It made loads of people angry ... Finns and foreign readers of The Times.
Anyways - sorry for "ranting", but ... I'm just still in total state of disbelief. It feels so surreal ...
kaska321 - 09.11.2007, 05:10
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Thanks Mario for sharing this . I learned a lot about your country from this post. Don`t be upset at those journalist, they probably never visit Finland and they use dry facts from old sources 
With all those lakes Finland must be beautiful country, and from all your post I assume has beautiful people too !
Poppy - 09.11.2007, 16:27
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kaska321 wrote: Thanks Mario for sharing this . I learned a lot about your country from this post. Don`t be upset at those journalist, they probably never visit Finland and they use dry facts from old sources
With all those lakes Finland must be beautiful country, and from all your post I assume has beautiful people too !
Thank you, kaska 
You are sweet!
(((HUGS)))
Marjo
char1984 - 10.11.2007, 06:04
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This is so sad and it seems to be happening all over the world.Dont understand what could even bring something so hateful to even happen..
ALW111 - 12.11.2007, 14:29
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Hi Marjo,
I'm so sorry to hear of this tragedy.
My thoughts are with the victims and their families.
I know for sure, that in the whole 17 years that my kids were at school.
The thought that I'd lose them to such a needless and tragic event such as this never once crossed my mind, and I doubt any other Parents mind.
It's unimaginable.
Are you okay Marjo ?
Working in a school yourself, you must have been shocked and left very shaken by it all.
I know it will be difficult, but try and put it to one side for a while, and give your worried mind a rest.
And remember how rare these kind of tragedy's are.
Alan.
Poppy - 12.11.2007, 21:07
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Thank you, Alan!
You are one of the sweetest and caring ppl I've ever met online! HONESTLY!
Your empathy / sympathy are something I can FEEL!
Thank you for being such a great friend ... and I hope to see you in London at some point 
ALW111 - 12.11.2007, 21:21
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Thank you for your very kind words Marjo.
I'm looking forward to the day we meet, more than anything right now.
Becoming your friend has been has been the nicest thing that has happened to me in a long time.
You are very special to me.
But I guess you already know that.
Alan...xxx...
P.S. What do you mean, " One of ?" LOL.
Poppy - 12.11.2007, 21:30
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ALW111 wrote: Thank you for your very kind words Marjo.
I'm looking forward to the day we meet, more than anything right now.
Becoming your friend has been has been the nicest thing that has happened to me in a long time.
You are very special to me.
But I guess you already know that.
Alan...xxx...
P.S. What do you mean, " One of ?" LOL.
AWW ALW So sweet! THANK YOU! AND ... ditto!
One of ... ??? LOL Am I busted now??? Uh oh ... OOPSIE LOL
Yeah - hopefully everything goes to plan and I am able to get the flights and stuff sorted ...
It's going to be cool to meet you and also cool to meet my other friends living in UK - old & new Can't wait ...
ALW111 - 12.11.2007, 21:46
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Well Marjo, I hope everything works out for you, and you have a great holiday.
You're so much fun to talk to, I can only imagine that you're a riot to be with.
Who wouldn't enjoy a holiday with you ?
No wonder your friends don't mind you going over. I bet they can't wait.
Don't forget to tell them that you'll be leaving them for an afternoon, to come an have a coffee with me.
Or better still, bring them with you, and we'll make a night of it. LOL.
I'm easy.
YTB
Alan..xx..
Poppy - 13.11.2007, 21:23
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ALW111 wrote: Well Marjo, I hope everything works out for you, and you have a great holiday.
You're so much fun to talk to, I can only imagine that you're a riot to be with.
Who wouldn't enjoy a holiday with you ?
No wonder your friends don't mind you going over. I bet they can't wait.
Don't forget to tell them that you'll be leaving them for an afternoon, to come an have a coffee with me.
Or better still, bring them with you, and we'll make a night of it. LOL.
I'm easy.
YTB
Alan..xx..
OMG Alan ...
You know what ... I'm totally blown away, speechless ... loss of words ...
What you just wrote was so sweet!!! THANK YOU!
What I have learned in this life ... there are people AND ... people -->
Nice surprises and massive disappointments.
You have definately been a nice surprise and chatting with you have been so fun!
I am so glad to have a friend like you!!!
(((HUGS)))
ALW111 - 14.11.2007, 08:49
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WOW !!!!
It's a good job you can't see me right now, because I'm glowing.
I've just woke up and saw your post.
And I just know, today is gonna be, a good day.
Thank You Marjo
Alan..x..
PokerGuru - 14.11.2007, 11:43
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Dearest Marjo and ALW,
I almost hate to interrupt your conversation, but I must express my concern for what seems to be spreading to your beautiful country, too, Marjo.
I wish I could pinpoint when and where it all first started, but I am not that good a historian. I am just a very sorry one.
Every individual has many choices to make every day.....many crossroads and at each we must choose which way to go. One way is always better than the way that is worse. I guess I will never understand why some choose to deliberately take the worst path, and I hope it is only my imagination that there seems to be more and more of them.
If it is a sign of the times, we who can MUST try to reverse the trend in any way we can, large or small. We can cry, yes, and we can sit alone and let our grief pour out, but then we MUST get back to our feet and fight for what is right.
It may be the last hope for mankind - resting on how many can and how many will.
I am sorry for your country, Marjo. I remember so well when I was shocked for my own.
Love to all,
Your Guru
valeria - 14.11.2007, 22:09
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Thank you Guru. Some posts my answers might be glaringly not there because I feel so much that I can't put it into words when it involves disaster of such brutality and useless loss of life. I just never know what to say that I feel would make any difference.
Now I can say.... ditto to Guru's post. Not much but is the best I can do right now.
I had this same experience in my own home town with a higher body count. Tragedies like this that you think could have been prevented somehow, someway. And I also feel so sorry for the families of not only the victims but the killer. The guilt and heartache they must go through knowing their child committed such an act.
To me it is unimaginable of what to say that would even remotely express what I feel.
Poppy - 15.11.2007, 03:56
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Thank you all for your thoughts ...
It's been sad, tragic, unbelievable ...
You're all PRECIOUS!
(((HUGS)))
PokerGuru - 15.11.2007, 08:40
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Valeria ,
I feel the same way about my post. "Not much, but it is all I can do right now."
Your Guru
crushadmin - 16.11.2007, 22:11
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... Ditto PokerGuru's and others comments and sympathies..
Very sorry to hear such tragedy in such a beautiful country, (and you're not the first to be angry about our press getting things wrong and won't be the last).
Geno
cindy7186 - 21.11.2007, 07:14
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such a terrible tragedy marjo,i pray for the families involved in this,how horrible it must be.i am literaly scared everyday that i drop my kids off at school,but i have no other choice i can only pray to god every night to please keep them safe!!!!!!!!
slotmom - 21.11.2007, 13:28
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Oh how sad I am so sorry my prayers are with them
Poppy - 21.11.2007, 14:55
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Cindy & Slotmom ...
Thank you for your messages ...
Lately the "dust has settled" - not much news about the shooting anymore.
I feel so sorry for the shooter's family also.
They live under police protection, because they've received some threats.
Can you really judge them as they didn't know what their son were capable to do ... They have to bear "the cross" of their son's actions the rest of their lives anyway ...
Some people are just blinded by hatred and anger which in a way is understandable - in another way not.
"Nov 8, 2007
Police analysed a suicide note and hate-filled Internet postings, searching for clues to what turned a bullied teenage outcast into an indiscriminate killer, as Finns mourned the victims of Wednesday's school massacre.
Flags were flying at half mast across the Nordic nation, grieving students placed candles outside the sealed-off high school in southern Finland and the president attended a memorial service for the victims in the capital - Helsinki.
Investigators said Pekka-Eric Auvinen, 18, appeared bent on causing maximum bloodshed as he opened fire Wednesday inside Jokela High School in Tuusula, some 30 miles north of Helsinki.
Apparently selecting his victims randomly, he killed six fellow students, the school nurse and the principal before turning the gun on himself, police said.
"There's nothing that links him with the victims except that they attended the same school," Detective Superintendent Tero Haapala said.
Haapala described Auvinen as a "lonely rider" who was bullied by other students. He said the motive for his rampage remained uncertain, "but the explanation can be found mainly in his Web writings and his social behaviour".
Police spokesman Goran Wennqvist told reporters that Auvinen left a suicide note before the attack, "saying goodbye to his family". He did not give details.
Investigators believe Auvinen revealed plans for the attack in postings on YouTube in which he urges revolution and grins after taking target practice.
Auvinen shot the victims with a .22-calibre pistol, police said, adding about a dozen other people were injured as they tried to escape from the school. The gunman then shot himself in the head, and died hours later at a hospital"
OH and BTW ... There is now Facebook group called "Roger Boyes Fan Club". It's dedicated to all who find these articles of Roger Boyes somewhat misleading and inaccurate. Already over 100 members.
Roger Boyes is the reporter who covered the shooting in British The Times which is respected news paper around the world ...
Well ... or WAS in my eyes anyway as I don't understand how such a "journalist" is still on a payroll of The Times as his articles were utter RUBBISH!
Anyway ... THANK YOU again for your kind words.
(((HUGS)))
Poppy - 21.11.2007, 15:16
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JUST A FINAL NOTE -
The artickle in quotes in my previous message above isn't taken from The Times.
It's a translation of Finnish news paper Helsingin Sanomat's - the number one news paper here in Finland - online news feed ...
OK - I am off to check the Boyes Facebook "fan club" ... and hopefully have a laugh ...
Here is the Roger Boyes Fan Club - http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=5649737508
Good one ...
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